Interesting, ruzuzu, however, it is not clear from OED Online whether "suck eggs" is used as a put-down. I believe if "go suck eggs" is used in such a way today it is because it is a substitute for the more vulgar counterpart, and that its meaning has therefore changed in light of the newer (1928 according to OED) usage of the word "suck". Furthermore, the Tom Sawyer reference seems to imply sucking eggs is a good thing, implying one has the courage to run up and steal eggs. Thanks for the comment.
GrantBarrett: - I don't see your point at all. The USA Today article makes the vacuous statement that the word "sucks" has a non-sexual meaning - of course this is obvious. What I want to see is someone to provide a usage of the term "sucks" that can show a lineage to another sense of the word other than the homosexual oral sex provider sense, which also represents some negative association. I don't believe such a usage has ever existed outside the underlying denigration of homosexual male activity.
My chain of reasoning is solid - male homosexual behavior of the "receptive" or "passive" kind is given negative connotations by the majority of human societies throughout history; thus references to such acts are used as derogatory phrases used to put down another person (or oneself) by implying that the other person practices such behavior and is therefore of lower status. Similar linguistic connections are made when someone says "f*ck you" or "we are screwed".
I am open to new evidence and will concede the point if it appears to be valid, but I don't think it exists.
I did not mean to create such a controversy with this, but I must say I find this discussion most interesting - one of my favorite topics is swear words and their meaning. Also just swearing a lot, which unfortunately I do.
You cannot seriously mean that society does not frown on male homosexual behavior? The origin of these kind of terms is in the lower status of a man who played the passive role in male-male sexual encounters - this is historically documented. Hence "sucks" became a generic put-down for a man and from there evolved into a general term for anything bad.
It is always easier to criticize than to suggest a better alternative, so I must confess I did not get that far in my thinking. Perhaps what bothers me other than the gay-slam aspect of it is its inherent vulgarity - to me it belongs in the "not-said-on-TV" set of words and phrases. I enjoy a good cuss frequently and don't like to see the value of my profanity cheapened by its increasing acceptability in popular culture. If I can't be offensive what's the point of cussing?
It is derogatory against gay men because creates a connection with some bad thing (the thing that sucks) with a particular sex act, which in this context is between two men. It is a gay act because that is the kind of sex which we as a society put down. The same thing happens with "f*** you" and "a**hole". All of these things put down a homosexual act and are used in a negative way.
I am suck and tired of OOPS sick and tired of this expression. It is now widely accepted in normal conversation and print despite its ignominious definition, and to say nothing of the pejorative meaning (putting down homosexual men) that drives its usage.
No disrespect intended to women who are naturally concerned with the essence of this phrase - it is just one of those trite little expressions that I find amusing.
I am surprised no one else has listed this overused annoying phrase. Maybe they were afraid of making me angry. But I listed it and now I have made myself angry.
I am adding this phrase to Dumbisms because frankly I have had enough of it. Its usage has become so ingrained in the minds of to many people and at this moment I am having a hard time thinking of a time when I heard someone use it appropriately. Even when it is used correctly it is often in some context that makes me want to ask the speaker to please please stop talking now.
Great list in the making - I hope you get tons more spam so you can add more to it. (kidding)
I am particularly amused by the "from" names that are provided. Somehow the spam names are always just a bit off, and sometimes they are wildly off. Like "Fulgham Slager" or "Aurora Rushing".
Have you seen any of the sites featuring poetry constructed entirely of spam? Greatly amusing.
This is the name of a number of very different old-time fiddle tunes. I assume 'musk' refers to that delightful odor of greenbacks. If you'ns have more info on it please let us know.
wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toot_Sweets): "The English expression toot sweet derives from the French phrase tout de suite (which means "immediately"). It first appears in English after the First World War, when, according to Mavens' Word of the Day, "many French words and expressions were borrowed by English-speaking soldiers."
(Q) From -----: “Do you know where the phrase hurts like the dickens comes from?�?
(A) Let’s focus in on dickens as the important word here, since there are lots of different expressions with it in, such as what the dickens, where the dickens, the dickens you are!, and the dickens you say!
It goes back a lot further than Charles Dickens, though it does seem to have been borrowed from the English surname, most likely sometime in the sixteenth century or before. (The surname itself probably derives from Dickin or Dickon, familiar diminutive forms of Dick.) It was — and still is, though people hardly know it any more — a euphemism for the Devil. It’s very much in the same style as deuce, as in old oaths like what the deuce! which contains another name for the Devil.
The first person known to use it was that great recorder of Elizabethan expressions, William Shakespeare, in The Merry Wives of Windsor: “FORD: Where had you this pretty weathercock? MRS PAGE: I cannot tell what the dickens his name is my husband had him of�?. That pun relied on the audience knowing that Dickens was a personal name and that what the dickens was a mild oath which called on the Devil.
From http://www.answers.com/topic/stomping-ground: "This term alludes to a traditional gathering place for horses or cattle, which stamp down the ground with their hooves. (Early 1800s)"
Vorpal - thanks for your comment about corporate-speak. I am at this minute enjoying a "Webinar" (I'm going to list that word on my hated words immediately) on SOA, and it is JARGON CITY! What a thrill!
Why doesn't this word exist? I hear it as one word, I think it as one word, but when I write it as one word I get a little squiggly red line under it, which is most unsightly.
One of the things I enjoy about this dum cliche is that considering the degree of communication that must have existed between pre-pre-prehistoric societies, which was basically no communication, the wheel itself was surely reinvented many times.
These kind of phrases all have a dark side too - they derive from an assumption that homosexual sex is wrong by common agreement. Not that I am recommending that people censor their speech but as linguists we must be mindful of the real meanings of words and phrases, right?
When I was a kid I was always impressed by this word. It was notorious for being the world's longest word. It probably made your browser add a horizontal scroll bar. "Ha-ha" (Nelson from the Simpsons)
Apparently this is some kind of pop culture rap music thing, but I heard it in a meeting at my company, so I associate with corporate culture's blunt lexicon.
Comments by thtownse
Show previous 200 comments...
thtownse commented on the word Wordnik
Like peacenik, sputnik, no-goodnik, clinnik.
December 11, 2009
thtownse commented on the word [anything] - gate
wordnikgate - nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
December 11, 2009
thtownse commented on the word [anything] - gate
Aren't people sick of labeling every new political scandal whatever"-gate"? Cuz I sure am.
December 11, 2009
thtownse commented on the word It sucks
Interesting, ruzuzu, however, it is not clear from OED Online whether "suck eggs" is used as a put-down. I believe if "go suck eggs" is used in such a way today it is because it is a substitute for the more vulgar counterpart, and that its meaning has therefore changed in light of the newer (1928 according to OED) usage of the word "suck". Furthermore, the Tom Sawyer reference seems to imply sucking eggs is a good thing, implying one has the courage to run up and steal eggs. Thanks for the comment.
December 11, 2009
thtownse commented on the word It sucks
GrantBarrett: - I don't see your point at all. The USA Today article makes the vacuous statement that the word "sucks" has a non-sexual meaning - of course this is obvious. What I want to see is someone to provide a usage of the term "sucks" that can show a lineage to another sense of the word other than the homosexual oral sex provider sense, which also represents some negative association. I don't believe such a usage has ever existed outside the underlying denigration of homosexual male activity.
My chain of reasoning is solid - male homosexual behavior of the "receptive" or "passive" kind is given negative connotations by the majority of human societies throughout history; thus references to such acts are used as derogatory phrases used to put down another person (or oneself) by implying that the other person practices such behavior and is therefore of lower status. Similar linguistic connections are made when someone says "f*ck you" or "we are screwed".
I am open to new evidence and will concede the point if it appears to be valid, but I don't think it exists.
I did not mean to create such a controversy with this, but I must say I find this discussion most interesting - one of my favorite topics is swear words and their meaning. Also just swearing a lot, which unfortunately I do.
December 11, 2009
thtownse commented on the word It sucks
You cannot seriously mean that society does not frown on male homosexual behavior? The origin of these kind of terms is in the lower status of a man who played the passive role in male-male sexual encounters - this is historically documented. Hence "sucks" became a generic put-down for a man and from there evolved into a general term for anything bad.
December 10, 2009
thtownse commented on the word It sucks
Actually, this is an interesting word-related issue; I'd like to know what other people think about this.
December 10, 2009
thtownse commented on the list seen-on-craigslist
This list has a lot of potential!
December 10, 2009
thtownse commented on the word It sucks
But it is never used to condemn women, only men. Society proscribes the passive role in sex when men do it; surely you would agree with that?
December 10, 2009
thtownse commented on the word It sucks
It is always easier to criticize than to suggest a better alternative, so I must confess I did not get that far in my thinking. Perhaps what bothers me other than the gay-slam aspect of it is its inherent vulgarity - to me it belongs in the "not-said-on-TV" set of words and phrases. I enjoy a good cuss frequently and don't like to see the value of my profanity cheapened by its increasing acceptability in popular culture. If I can't be offensive what's the point of cussing?
It is derogatory against gay men because creates a connection with some bad thing (the thing that sucks) with a particular sex act, which in this context is between two men. It is a gay act because that is the kind of sex which we as a society put down. The same thing happens with "f*** you" and "a**hole". All of these things put down a homosexual act and are used in a negative way.
December 10, 2009
thtownse commented on the word It sucks
I am suck and tired of OOPS sick and tired of this expression. It is now widely accepted in normal conversation and print despite its ignominious definition, and to say nothing of the pejorative meaning (putting down homosexual men) that drives its usage.
December 9, 2009
thtownse commented on the word savvy
This is one of my most hated words.
December 4, 2009
thtownse commented on the word opensourcefood
Er, wha'?
November 17, 2009
thtownse commented on the word The Wisdom of Our Ancestors
Excellent - clearly he did not want to live in a bleak house.
November 17, 2009
thtownse commented on the word reason being
This phrase is one I have never heard or read in a non-dumb context, hence its inclusion as a dumbism.
October 9, 2008
thtownse commented on the word toward
I like this word in its adjectival usage.
September 4, 2008
thtownse commented on the word rumoured
Also interesting considering how words are often expanded in today's usage, such as the dreaded "leveraging" or even worse, "visioning".
August 29, 2008
thtownse commented on the word gossip
Fantastic! That is why I love etymology.
August 13, 2008
thtownse commented on the word post-baby body
No disrespect intended to women who are naturally concerned with the essence of this phrase - it is just one of those trite little expressions that I find amusing.
August 13, 2008
thtownse commented on the word celeb
Ugh.
August 13, 2008
thtownse commented on the word panties
"covers the subject" - ha!
August 13, 2008
thtownse commented on the word palaver
This word was used by Rudyard Kipling to refer to a meeting or gathering. One can see the relationship with its 'current' meaning.
August 13, 2008
thtownse commented on the list chromatic-phrases
Cool list sionnach. It really shows a way we like to combine concepts into phrases.
August 13, 2008
thtownse commented on the word frenemy
What a dum word.
August 12, 2008
thtownse commented on the word part and parcel
I really hate this phrase - makes me cringe.
August 11, 2008
thtownse commented on the word on the cheap
I am surprised no one else has listed this overused annoying phrase. Maybe they were afraid of making me angry. But I listed it and now I have made myself angry.
August 8, 2008
thtownse commented on the word diddy wah diddy
An article about this tune:
http://www.hawkeyeherman.com/pdf/diddie_wa_diddie.pdf
July 1, 2008
thtownse commented on the word acrost
These citations may well be authentic, but this word in common usage is still bad English. I second the ARGH.
June 30, 2008
thtownse commented on the word diddy wah diddy
YAY! I love this tune (Blind Blake, Leon Redbone) But do you know what Diddy Wah Diddy means?
June 30, 2008
thtownse commented on the word gas music from jupiter
This is such an excellent phrase when you compare the composition of the planet Jupiter with that of earth.
June 30, 2008
thtownse commented on the word meet and greet
Yuck - I hate this one, and hear it all the time.
June 30, 2008
thtownse commented on the word powder-monkey
Awesome - this phrase is used in "March of the Black Queen" by Queen, written by the late great Freddie Mercury. What does it mean though?
June 30, 2008
thtownse commented on the word had had
I love it when people say this in a sentence: "she had had enough of his tomfoolery"
June 26, 2008
thtownse commented on the word boob
At the risk of being sexist I just think it is so great that we use the word 'boob' for a body part - it's funny!
June 26, 2008
thtownse commented on the word genitalia
This is the only word that sounds worse than 'genitals'.
June 26, 2008
thtownse commented on the word genitals
Almost any known euphemism is better-sounding that the actual word - come on people, that's why we have euphemisms in the first place!
June 26, 2008
thtownse commented on the word riding herd
Not as in "Little Red Riding Herd"
June 26, 2008
thtownse commented on the word politically correct
I am adding this phrase to Dumbisms because frankly I have had enough of it. Its usage has become so ingrained in the minds of to many people and at this moment I am having a hard time thinking of a time when I heard someone use it appropriately. Even when it is used correctly it is often in some context that makes me want to ask the speaker to please please stop talking now.
June 20, 2008
thtownse commented on the list spam--2
Great list in the making - I hope you get tons more spam so you can add more to it. (kidding)
I am particularly amused by the "from" names that are provided. Somehow the spam names are always just a bit off, and sometimes they are wildly off. Like "Fulgham Slager" or "Aurora Rushing".
Have you seen any of the sites featuring poetry constructed entirely of spam? Greatly amusing.
June 6, 2008
thtownse commented on the word money musk
This is the name of a number of very different old-time fiddle tunes. I assume 'musk' refers to that delightful odor of greenbacks. If you'ns have more info on it please let us know.
Although according to this (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=money%20musk) 'musk' has a different derivation (check it out chortle chortle)
June 6, 2008
thtownse commented on the word blankety-blank
Thanks for listing - I love this 'word'!
June 6, 2008
thtownse commented on the word curse of 27
Of course, an extremely unhealthy lifestyle centered around drugs and booze is also unlucky.
June 6, 2008
thtownse commented on the word all intensive purposes
I mean, like, come on now?
June 6, 2008
thtownse commented on the word toot sweet
wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toot_Sweets): "The English expression toot sweet derives from the French phrase tout de suite (which means "immediately"). It first appears in English after the First World War, when, according to Mavens' Word of the Day, "many French words and expressions were borrowed by English-speaking soldiers."
May 9, 2008
thtownse commented on the word cupola
I'm glad this word has been listed a cupola times.
May 6, 2008
thtownse commented on the word surf the web
I just think the use of the term 'surf' when speaking about the internet is dumb. Don't know why, it just is.
April 18, 2008
thtownse commented on the word the deuce
See the dickens
April 15, 2008
thtownse commented on the word the dickens
From http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-dic3.htm:
(Q) From -----: “Do you know where the phrase hurts like the dickens comes from?�?
(A) Let’s focus in on dickens as the important word here, since there are lots of different expressions with it in, such as what the dickens, where the dickens, the dickens you are!, and the dickens you say!
It goes back a lot further than Charles Dickens, though it does seem to have been borrowed from the English surname, most likely sometime in the sixteenth century or before. (The surname itself probably derives from Dickin or Dickon, familiar diminutive forms of Dick.) It was — and still is, though people hardly know it any more — a euphemism for the Devil. It’s very much in the same style as deuce, as in old oaths like what the deuce! which contains another name for the Devil.
The first person known to use it was that great recorder of Elizabethan expressions, William Shakespeare, in The Merry Wives of Windsor: “FORD: Where had you this pretty weathercock? MRS PAGE: I cannot tell what the dickens his name is my husband had him of�?. That pun relied on the audience knowing that Dickens was a personal name and that what the dickens was a mild oath which called on the Devil.
April 15, 2008
thtownse commented on the word stomping ground
From http://www.answers.com/topic/stomping-ground: "This term alludes to a traditional gathering place for horses or cattle, which stamp down the ground with their hooves. (Early 1800s)"
April 14, 2008
thtownse commented on the word re-look
It's like, is this the best way you can think of to express this idea?
March 19, 2008
thtownse commented on the word turnaround time
a bizniss cliche
March 10, 2008
thtownse commented on the word wordie orphan syndrome
This sounds cool - please explain?
February 23, 2008
thtownse commented on the word ker-leaf
Excellent! - (from Peanuts?)
February 15, 2008
thtownse commented on the word on the top of your head
- a substitute for "off the top of your head"
February 15, 2008
thtownse commented on the user vorpal
Vorpal - thanks for your comment about corporate-speak. I am at this minute enjoying a "Webinar" (I'm going to list that word on my hated words immediately) on SOA, and it is JARGON CITY! What a thrill!
February 13, 2008
thtownse commented on the word lesson learned
an overused cliche
January 26, 2008
thtownse commented on the list vorpal-s-words
"Vorpal's Words" - excellent
December 28, 2007
thtownse commented on the list evil-marketing-words-that-upon-use-should-cause-the-perpetrator-to-be-smited
Crush them! Crush them all!
December 28, 2007
thtownse commented on the word aibohphobia
YES!!
December 22, 2007
thtownse commented on the word just144ice
Good one
December 22, 2007
thtownse commented on the word mce mce mce
Excellent
December 22, 2007
thtownse commented on the word ipoisev
Good one
December 22, 2007
thtownse commented on the list what-i-thought-wordies-were-before-i-discovered-wordie
Fantastic - thanks for doing this one!
December 21, 2007
thtownse commented on the word noone
Why doesn't this word exist? I hear it as one word, I think it as one word, but when I write it as one word I get a little squiggly red line under it, which is most unsightly.
December 7, 2007
thtownse commented on the list misspoken
Thanks, bilby. Sounds like a clear case of cross-pollination.
December 7, 2007
thtownse commented on the word extravaganza
What about the regular vaganza?
December 7, 2007
thtownse commented on the word pantoum
Are we a Rush fan by any chance???
December 7, 2007
thtownse commented on the word skeletons from the closet
Overheard spoken by someone of Eastern European birth
December 7, 2007
thtownse commented on the list misspoken
That's flan-tastic. Thanks
December 7, 2007
thtownse commented on the word reinvent the wheel
One of the things I enjoy about this dum cliche is that considering the degree of communication that must have existed between pre-pre-prehistoric societies, which was basically no communication, the wheel itself was surely reinvented many times.
December 2, 2007
thtownse commented on the list how-does-it-suck-let-me-count-the-ways
These kind of phrases all have a dark side too - they derive from an assumption that homosexual sex is wrong by common agreement. Not that I am recommending that people censor their speech but as linguists we must be mindful of the real meanings of words and phrases, right?
October 24, 2007
thtownse commented on the word unfuggled
I got this from the site guidelines. This is a one febsite.
October 23, 2007
thtownse commented on the list into-the-mystic
You make nice lists.
October 23, 2007
thtownse commented on the list neology
One helluva list
October 23, 2007
thtownse commented on the word bar
I love programming language grammar and the way it folds, spindles and mutilates English.
October 23, 2007
thtownse commented on the word antidisestablishmentariansism
When I was a kid I was always impressed by this word. It was notorious for being the world's longest word. It probably made your browser add a horizontal scroll bar. "Ha-ha" (Nelson from the Simpsons)
October 23, 2007
thtownse commented on the word re-up
Apparently this is some kind of pop culture rap music thing, but I heard it in a meeting at my company, so I associate with corporate culture's blunt lexicon.
October 23, 2007
thtownse commented on the user thtownse
I am leaving a comment about myself!
October 23, 2007